Today on the Book More Show, I'm excited to share a really great conversation with Jamie Shibley from The Expressory about the opportunities to create a strategic engagement plan that keeps you top of mind.

Jamie shares her Dream 25 process, which nurtures high-value potential clients with personalized touchpoints throughout the year. This aligns so well with the top 150 approach we've spoken about in the past that I'm sure Jamie's approach will resonate.

We explore how outsourcing tasks like customized gift sourcing frees up time while ensuring the ideas are impactful and relevant to clients' interests. Our insights highlight the importance of maintaining engagement through various channels.

As you listen, you'll also inevitably make the connection back to your book and how orchestrating a plan can really engage the individual clients you want to do business with. 

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS

1. Jamie Shibley from The Expressory introduces the Dream 25 process, a strategic engagement method aimed at nurturing relationships with top prospects over a year through personalized touchpoints.

2. We discuss the challenge that business leaders face in maintaining consistent engagement with their clients and prospects due to time constraints.

3. The episode explores how personalized gestures, such as sending customized gifts or books, can significantly enhance client loyalty and retention in the professional services industry.

4. We consider the benefits of outsourcing the tasks of strategic engagement and thoughtful gifting to save time and ensure efficiency and impact.

5. There's a discussion on the importance of aligning engagement strategies with clients' values and interests to create authentic business connections.

6. Jamie and I touch on the idea of decommoditizing services by showing genuine care and helpfulness through personalized outreach.

7. We highlight how strategic gifting and personalized engagement can potentially lead to referrals and other business opportunities.

8. The episode underscores the significance of intentionality and thoughtfulness in business communications, especially in a digital and transactional world.

9. Listeners are encouraged to provide feedback and connect with Jamie for further insights on strategic engagement and relationship-building in business.

10. Practical examples are offerred for listeners seeking to refine their own engagement approaches.

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TRANSCRIPT
(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

Jamie: And so what? We work with a process, that is, we've picked it up there's a term out there Dream 25 process that says that you know, once a year, define a list of 25 of your top dream prospects highly valuable and design a series of touch points to get in front of them and start to build a relationship that will be sent over the course of a year.

Stuart: Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Bookmore Show. It's Stuart here, and today joined by Jamie Shibley. Jamie, how are you?

Jamie: doing wonderful, how are you?

Stuart: I'm good, thank you, I'm good. I was at quite a few in-person meetings this week. So I often say to people I can talk on the phone for days and it's fine, but as soon as I get in real world my voice disappears. So I'm sounding a little bit more like it was a cigar convention, but but really it wasn't, it's just my voice goes, yeah it's funny how that works.

Jamie: I think it's like you have to talk louder in person.

Stuart: I don't know yeah, the projection element definitely. No career as an opera singer, yeah you and me both right.

I'm excited by today's conversation. So oftentimes we're sharing introducing people to their audience and the business that they do. They've maybe we've talked about before or there's an obvious connection. I think what stood out when we were first introduced is just your pretty unique approach to something that people will have come across before. We'll get to what it is in a second, but people will have come across it before generally. But I think the way that you guys approach it specifically is pretty unique and ties in well with what we're doing. So, as people are thinking about writing books to start the conversation, what you do really keeps that conversation going, both with prospects and clients. So why don't we start a little bit with, uh, some background on on you and the organization?

Jamie: yeah, so the expressory is a strategic engagement um agency right. So we help uh service providers um, professional service providers find and nurture their right fist prospects and also create loyalty with their existing clients. And I think the way you set it up is perfect because it is it's about that continuing the conversation, but really it's it's continuing to build and strengthen that relationship. I just this morning saw a quote. I don't know if you're familiar with Adam Grant. Author. Yeah, it's something like transaction. People who are transactional about their relationships only talk to you when they need something from you. Right, it's about their network and how you can serve them. The people who approach things on our relationship base talk to you when they think about you and when they care about you.

And that's really what we're trying to change. The approach in business is helping these business leaders who get it, who, who approach what they do in business from a relationship first standpoint what they do in business from a relationship first standpoint really show that they care about the people in their community on an ongoing basis when they don't have time to do it Right.

Stuart: That's a great point. It's that not only introducing the idea and resonating with the people who do get it and do understand that it's not only a higher value but it's a higher contribution to the community to stay in touch, not just when you want something but when you think of them, but then the, the, um, the procedural side of it, the remembering to do it. I'm almost the, the. I'm a classic example of someone who enjoys doing it, thinks to do it occasionally, but nowhere near as much. I don't get to chance to execute on it anywhere near as much as I would like to in a perfect world. So do you find that with clients it's maybe less about introducing the idea and more about the solution, the easy nature of what you enable people to do?

Jamie: Well, it's interesting because my first response to you was you are absolutely not alone and, quite honestly, like I was terrible, I still am terrible about it in my personal life. It's part of how I got here, like I was the person where the birthday cards are always late. But in business, you're absolutely right. I mean the reason you're not alone, because we have to run a business too, we have to do all the other things, and so it's an interesting question because some people yes, they come to us because, oh, thank goodness, like I knew this was an option, you do it for us. But we also find I think about half of people don't even know that it's an option to outsource it.

Stuart: Oh, wow, okay.

Jamie: And if they had an idea? The people that know about the solutions. I think they're familiar with other services who you know they're gifting companies or things like that but they don't quite do it the same way we do, meaning as the business leader. I'd look at it and say but they're not going to do it how I would want it done.

Stuart: Right.

Jamie: And that's to me what's important is that the work we do with you as the business owner has to reflect you and the care that you want to put out into the world yeah, it's an interesting point.

Stuart: I was just came off another call. We were talking to someone about this idea, that, um, that just because tying it in with the way that you would want to do it and having that as the driving force and not coming to it from the point of view of we've got access to gifts that we want to send as a transactional thing, it's almost the gifts become secondary to the opportunity to have the conversation, to connect, rather than, hey, this is a product and this is just a mechanism for sending the product. The conversation earlier was talking about books. We were saying that a lot of our competitors come to the book space from a publishing world where the book is the product and a lot of their approach is around the book being the thing and then everything else is secondary, whereas for us, the conversation is the product. The whole purpose of what we do is to allow people to get into conversation. A book just happens to be the one of the most effective ways of doing it so that slight change and and you guys, I think, are the same.

It's the approach first, the purpose first, and then the tool and the mechanism second right.

Jamie: I you know, when you and I first met your, your comment, the, the mindset change that offered, like you got to think about it like this is a conversation that's wonderful, that is a fantastic way to think about what you're pouring into the book, and I think you're exactly right. That's why we call this strategic engagement right, because it's creating the engagement that you really want with all those prospects and clients and, by the way, all the people that support you, because they deserve that care and attention and acknowledgement just as much.

Stuart: Right, let's dive into some examples then, maybe so the audiences we're listening here we send out to all the people on our list. So, primarily professional services companies perfect fit for the type of work that you're doing. We've got accountants, who are always the ones that spring to mind. I don't know whether it's my background is slightly in financial services or whether it's just accountants begin with a and in my head that's the one I get to first.

But those types of professional services organizations they've got long relationships with clients. They've got pretty robust referral networks or partner networks with people that they like, as you mentioned. They've got their team, and then they've got pretty robust referral networks or partner networks with people that they like, as you mentioned. They've got their team, and then they've got the list of unconverted prospects people where they've started conversations but not not converted yet. So what types of things? If a business owner came to you with hey, this is the audience. I know that I want to be better at engaging with people. What's's the type of things that you would begin to talk about?

Jamie: Well, it's interesting If we let's let's talk about some specifics, because you brought up like accounting and financial services, so we work with a number of financial, you know, wealth advisors, CPAs, accountants and with them because of, you know, compliance, it's it's a lot more about the relationships with existing clients and, if you think about that world, they're rewarded for their customer experience and you want those customers for life, and then you want their referrals, as you said, and so the best way to do that is to showcase that here and that you are always thinking of them, you know, and so we've had some wealth advisors transfer over to us. You know, for years they've had wonderful personal touch with their existing clients on birthdays I'm thinking of one in particular Every year they'd spend let's say it was like you know know, seven thousand dollars a month on sending flowers to all of the clients each month for the birthdays, right? Um, it's flowers, and while it's a wonderful gesture and certainly there are people who absolutely love it and would like nothing more um, not lasting, right. And so they came over to not only because it can be outsourced, it's taken off their team's plate, it's executed for them.

Every month, a list is coming over and what we've done is we've created almost like this catalog of opportunity you know, birthday gifts where, based on what they know about the people in that month list, they can go through and pick oh, send a wellness gift to this person, oh, this person is the. You know the whiskey drinker? Oh, this person. And so it's very personalized. But it becomes extremely easy to execute because we know, you know each each advisor is simply going through a list and saying, okay, a, b, c, oh, just birthday card for this one. So not only have we saved them money, but we've gotten meaningful because their personal gifts and the hands of their clients that are lasting and you know they tell us that they have never received so many points of engagement acknowledging the thank yous and the. You know they tell us that they have never received so many points of engagement acknowledging the thank yous and the addition. What you're really doing right is you're sparking that additional conversation. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's a very specific example. Sorry, long story, but no, no, no.

Stuart: And that's a great example because I think, even though we've spoken before and I've kind of got some understanding of what it is that you guys do, it's still it's like for us when people say book, they think traditional book, not conversation starting book. So it's a continual opportunity to bridge that gap into the thing that we do that we believe is much more effective. So, even though we've had that conversation before, it's still. When you think about gift giving and the physical unless you want to, but the specificity and the personalization and the to be able to execute that internally, the flowers were a $7,000 budget and it took 10 hours of time to try and personalize it for each person I mean that immediately becomes unsustainable. So just dialing in the opportunity.

Jamie: But let's stay with your book example, because we do have a lot of authors and even what we tell people is that even if you're not an author, leveraging a book is fantastic. Okay, so we do a lot of work with prospects, so agency owners are. We have clients who are. Agency owners are always looking for you know you want to have that new business pipeline, right, but it's very easy to get caught up in the day-to-day and all the management, but forget about this until it all dries up, right. And so what?

We work with a process that is, we we've picked it up, there's a, there's a term out there dream 25 process that says that highly valuable and design a series of touch points to get in front of them and start to build a relationship that will be sent over the course of a year. And so ideally, if you do this right, you're planning this up front and it's just executed throughout the year. When we design that for people, we frequently look for an opportunity to include a book, whether it is yours because you're an author, or it is some sort of topical conversation piece. It is valuable because what you're doing when you're nurturing, what you want to do when you're designing this is that whatever you put in front of that prospect needs to be helpful. You want to help them be better at their job and in their world, and usually a book has that great information to be helpful.

Stuart: Yeah, that's. This is funny, because this, I mean, this is why we've had a couple of calls already and we've got more calls lined up, because the synergy in what we do is so dialed in and the approach is aligned as well. So we talk to people a lot about this idea of oftentimes they'll talk about, they'll get on our calendar, we'll talk to them about the book, some of the early questions okay, what do you want to achieve? So one of the early conversations is around this idea of visible and invisible prospects. So oftentimes we're talking to people about a book is a great way of identifying invisible prospects, because you can put it out there, ads and that type of thing. And then the people who are self-selecting because of the nature of what was written. It identifies the invisible prospects, but for a lot of organizations the opportunity is in the visible prospects.

So, like you said with the Dream 25. So we'll dial in this idea of okay, imagine that you were just writing to that one person. This project becomes valuable if you execute on that business. So let's just dial it down to that helping guide, the, the mind and the thought. What I'd like, and I think there's a real synergy between the people who are of that mindset with us, and then what you can then facilitate is that execution of the long-term plan to get that engagement going. And I think for anyone where they have got that visible prospect list, which is, I mean, the majority of businesses out there could at least write down 25 well, you would think, but it is very like one of the first roadblocks we get is okay, we'll give us your list yeah, okay, that's interesting, but I think it's again because we didn't take the time.

Jamie: You know, I mean we're so busy with the visible list, right, because that was easy or that was you know.

Stuart: Yeah, right, yeah, just the top of the phone because it doesn't take any. There's not the drilling down or the thinking about it yeah, yeah.

I imagine that a lot of people when you ask them. Well, you can imagine that if you're trying to address some particular who's's, your ideal, put in mind, your ideal prospect. Okay, now imagine who they are. Okay, I can imagine that. Do they have some similarities? Yeah, they've got some similarities. Okay, well, who are those names? Ah, well, when it goes from kind of the broad to the narrow conception to the individual. But there must be so many tools I'm talking fast and I'm getting enthusiastic about the idea but there must. There are so many tools out there that can help. Now I mean even linkedin, for goodness sake, if nothing else, to narrow down who that person is. I wonder whether some of it is kind of like the analysis, paralysis or the fear of missing out. Oh, if I give you these 25 names, there might be 25 other names I don't write down and the kind of FOMO type thing yeah, I think there's some of that.

Jamie: I think there's. I think we block ourselves in a lot of ways. Well, even if I found that company, how do I know who to talk to? Oh, how do I know they're really in that position and we just keep stopping ourselves right so interesting enough, we just did, um, I just wrapped up a blog series on teaching this process, because if they do have a list and let's say, you, you know, as business leader, you've got five, you've got ten. Okay, I mean, you can start there so say they have that.

Now you ask them okay, what do you know about those companies? I know their address.

Stuart: I know their phone number, you know what I mean.

Jamie: Like all right, but how are we going to figure out what to send? Them, if you don't know much more. And so then you know. The next step is well, now you got to drill in and learn something about what are their challenges, what are their goals, what are their pain. You know who do they serve, because if again, again, if you're coming from the place of you want to show them, you are a helpful person worth knowing.

Stuart: Um, you got to know something about them yeah, I recorded a podcast yesterday so I think it's probably going to go the week before. Everyone listens to this. Okay, say, oh, uh, tim wachel, I think you know guys know each other sales professional, sales training expert. So does a lot of um, yeah, now I'm going, and it was just yesterday. I think you guys know each other. I'm probably butchering his surname because I tripped over it last time, but anyway, he so he's a sales professional, goes out and trains sales teams, but very much from the approach of just as you were describing. He calls it peddlers versus partners. If you're a peddler trying to transactionally sell things, then you're just engaging in the moment that you want to do some business, or at the last minute, and it's all about the close, the cell, whereas if you're a partner, you're much more interested in that long-term conversation and checking in when you think about people, exactly as you said, um, in, in fact, nothing to do. The podcast, but I'll connect to you guys on linkedin because the conversations you talk in very similar ways. So there's, there's again, it's uh, it's this like-minded community which is really the community that the podcast goes to as well, because people are receiving the email that will send out because they've explicitly expressed a preference in communicating and starting a conversation by adding value. It isn't a isn't a list of people who want to maximize row us on facebook ads. It's people who want to maximize ROAS on Facebook ads. It's people who want to give something more to the community.

The idea that you were talking about the Dream 25 and the connecting with people over the long term. We talk a lot. Again, the idea that the book is a conversation starter, so the benefit is in the follow-up. Again, the idea that the book is a conversation starter, so the benefit is in the follow-up. For the most part, we're talking about email sequences usually and keeping people engaged. That way, we do some individual work with people. That's a little bit more detailed than that, but for most of the conversations it's that educational follow-up piece. Talk a little bit more about what the follow-up is in your world, though, because you're obviously switching it into physical from digital, although I'm assuming there's opportunities.

Jamie: Yeah, yep, and we definitely. We will tell them up front. You know there's going to be it's got to be a mix, so there's going to be moments in this. What we do is, in the course of a year, we plan seven different touch points.

Stuart: Okay.

Jamie: Some of them should be digital right, and whether that be okay. I've sent you a couple things to get in front of you. Now I'm going to digitally invite you to, you know, interview on this podcast, right?

Because, that's my opportunity to bring you a little bit closer. Let's get to know each other. I'm going to invite you to, you know, maybe they're having a physical event and but so there's some digital or or. I'm going to send you some articles that are very specific to your industry, because I see that you guys are struggling with, or you know you, you share a lot of content on XYZ. I saw this. Maybe you're interested in it. We'll make those recommendations.

We leave a placeholder for that, and so we invite them to think about their own assets, their own materials. Maybe it's eBooks. They've done some research, right, Fill those in and then we come to the table with the physical items. But again, it's not necessarily just sending you know this a bunch of chocolate. Now, it's been done. It is. It has been done that you know, one of our clients sent 10 pounds of chocolate to their their list, and the people who are so blown away they actually saw, um, our clients at events and they're like, what did I do to get on your list? I mean, so it, it has its place, okay there's a way to do it.

It involves the messaging um but but a lot of the stuff. We look for what? What? Um, let me go back to research. So, as you've dug in to the people that are on your list and you're finding industry trends, you're finding you know this company is very focused on sustainability. This company is all about wellness. When you learn those things, there are certain themes that start to appear across your list. Then we take those themes and we look for how can we represent that with something helpful that you send to them. And this is where someone was just showing us that they pitched one of their clients. They saw that one of the prospects very into the Ohio State football, but he was also, you know, he's, a leader in the company and so they were talking about pitching a book written by one of the previous coaches.

you know from the football team, so you can see the detail, the thought that went into it, into planning these things, and that's what we look for. One more example I get just as wound up as you in this stuff, but one of our clients what we noticed across their 15 prospects, three different industries, but they all had a focus on this well-being, and so we proposed a gift. We gave a multiple options, but it was about wellness and the messages said. You know, we believe that you've now finished the first quarter of the year. Chances are you're moving fast. It can be stressful, you know, to run these stressful businesses. We really believe that, along with the work you do, you should take some time to invest in yourself. So here's a few items to remind you. So, in this particular case, it was pull up your favorite meditation app if you don't have one. Our team is always happy to make recommendations, but you can see it was nothing at all about the work they do, right. Nothing, no sales. It wasn't even a. You know this is my website.

Stuart: It's simply going to be signed by the owners of the company yeah, that orchestration of the idea for the long call, like without expectation, that this one email is going to be the thing to close and we're going to judge the whole success of the campaign on this one touch point. The fact that it's orchestrated and thought out and considered and there's a longer run to it than just what so many other people do, I think is the kind of Facebook ad to lead and if they haven't bought within the next 12 hours then it's dead and they're never contacted again yeah yeah, exactly, it's that thought that goes behind it and for the majority of people listening and the majority of people in our world, it's not a transactional turnaround, it's not checkout purchases, it's not commoditized assets or if the actual tool itself is commoditized.

I was talking to someone yesterday who owns a photography um for real real estate photography company in san Diego. So they're young guys. They've come into it recently. They were more kind of like drone pilots and had it as a hobby and then started offering it. So they're not photographers who have then developed a business. They went into this one in the business and the opportunity.

So, again, similar to what we were saying before, the purpose and the the tool. The photography element is just the tool. So real estate photography is relatively commoditized because there's a lot of people doing it and it's not. There's no real barrier to entry. But I was saying to them that the difference that they can make is the real estate agents, particularly now, given some recent legislation changes. It's now a listing agent world. It's not a buyer's agent world because there's no monetization there, so it's a listing agent world.

So the key metric for realtors success in the long run is their ability to close listing deals well if the photographer guys can make sizzle reels for the realtor that they can show in the listing presentation, yeah, it promotes why they're the people to get. That brings them in as a partner and it decommoditizes them from oh we just take great photos and we're the cheapest into. No, we understand that the single job of work that you have now is closing these listing appointments and we're giving you enough to do that. So, anyway, a bit of a tangent there. But this idea that it's thinking about that, it's orchestrating that journey, it's a long run, it's showing value as a partner, not just trying to close, close, close.

Jamie: Right, well, and they're showing they're helpful and that they understand. So one more nugget that kind of feeds into what we do. There's actual social psychology behind the foundations of relationships.

that say that in order for a relationship to form and to be lasting, people need to know that you understand them. They need to feel that you validate what's important to them, like you just explained, in the realtor industry. In the real estate industry, it changed, and by if they approach it from. This is what's now important we understand it. Here's how we can help. They are validating what's important to those prospects Right.

And then the third thing is care, and that needs to be if, if a person perceives that you care, that is a last, that's a reason for me to be in a relationship with you. So, as long as you focus on those three things understanding, validation of what's important and care you are moving that relationship into something solid for the long term. Right, and so I think you've got you know, I agree, we are very aligned in our approach and you're trying to. You're taking these books and you're trying to help your clients understand. It's not just this thing and done, right, right, this is the start. This is your, you know your, your conversation starter. It's the thing that's going to maybe capture attention. But how thoughtful you are from there forward is going to determine the relationships you create out of it.

Now I just invite you to think, create out of it. Now. I just invite you to think if I did this to you, if I were sending you some of those things that I just gave you examples, so you know, every seven weeks, the first thing, you got some book from me, and then you get this nice package about something I understand about you, and it still has no, there's no cell in it. Wouldn't you be intrigued, just at least to connect, to know me.

This person is interesting right and I promise you maybe it never converts to a sale of them being your client, but most people want to take the time to get to know you and you never know what other opportunity they can bring for you, because maybe it's not them, but they know other people.

Stuart: Right, yeah, that's a great point, tying in that or thinking about this kind of second tier order of the referral opportunity, and if some of the messages aren't direct commercial intent for you, but sowing the subtle seed of hey, here's some way. If you know of anyone else having this problem, give them pointers allowing them to be the um, the rainmaker within their sphere of influence, kind of just giving those opportunities to elevate their social status through things that you're able to do. It's, um, much more considered than just the hey, we sell widgets.

Jamie: You should buy them from us, right? Yeah, business people get it.

Stuart: Right, yeah, yeah, and I think these days where there's I mean there's Lucy, my wife is a kindergarten teacher, so in a Waldorf school, so they're very much not they're very much focused on the individuals in the moment in the classroom and not that they separate themselves from technology in any way, but it's very individual, focused on the people in the space. So as part of their reading they've read the. This example would be better if I could remember the name of the book, but the attention, oh and the premise of the book is that generations now are disconnected because of cell phones and social media and not having that personal connection or experience with people. And then there's a couple of other books that are kind of COVID related and how the psychological elements that had. But that one-on-one connection, whether it's kindergartners or high schoolers or 20-year-old employees or me who's no longer 20, that connection that you have with people.

There is a transactional element to the fact that so much of it is online, but there's also the opportunity to make a connection and it's not quite the same as being in the office or being on a train with someone and and spending that extended period of time, but there is a way, I think, even within condensed time frames, of having more of a meaningful connection with with a person because of a thoughtfulness that you put in it. So, like I'm thinking about our connection with LinkedIn, I mean, it was a connection from a trusted third party, so there was a little bit more there, but within a half hour conversation we had a pretty meaningful connection because there was a commonality and an intentionality that we brought to it. So, anyway, anyway, without getting too kind of woo-woo about, it no, no, I yeah, but that's what I like about what you do.

It's not just his. You should send something to people because it interrupts their day and it's a what's like the dan kennedy squeezy package type thing.

Jamie: It's not that, it's the making a thoughtful connection and the thing that is sent just illustrates how thoughtful that that connection is that you're trying to be but I think you're tapping into with the examples of the books, um, because I've actually got a couple of them um on my shelf, um, this is what's, I think, changing, changing about our world, and it's been moving fast for about the, in this digital space that we're losing. We're losing a societal, there's a societal disconnect, and it's more important than I think we realized. And so, by helping businesses, I mean I don't know to me, this is my woo side. Helping business, I mean I don't know to me, this is my my woo side. But that's that's what drives me, is if I'm helping one. So we actually handwrite all of our messages and there are times when the, the team will know totally cow, did you like that message?

Stuart: it makes us feel like we can feel it in the wording, um, and that's when we know you know you're doing it right it resonates, yeah yeah, yeah it does have that kind of um I don't know if I mean synergy is the word, but it kind of doesn't quite capture it but the, it's more than the sum of the parts. There's like a meaning that carries through. So right, I think there's so much opportunity for us to be transactional and fast and quick and just play a volume game, because that's the, the, the nature of how technology scales and with I mean we haven't even touched on ai type stuff, but the, the scalability of that just increases even more. And from a book perspective.

But even now we get people saying why can't I just write this with ai? And I mean, you can write something, but the outcome is you want to be in conversation with someone. So if they turn up having read your words in the way that you describe, that's very different from having read some words that talk about something. So the same with you guys. I'm sure there's technological based solutions that people will try just to get a push button answer to. But yes, use the technology to, to, to gather the information, but adding the connection, the intentionality, the personal touch, that's that's difficult to do without that human element of connection in there somewhere yeah we ended on a bit of a philosophical tangent.

I think it's important, but it is.

Jamie: It makes a difference yeah, I think we're seeing a little bit of a shift, like people are feeling tired of digital. The I mean ai is going to be great from a productivity standpoint and from, I mean, even what it's going to be able to stall for us, right, but from a human standpoint, yeah, you know you got to get the other side right too yeah, exactly, and that's a great point.

Stuart: That's the opportunity it will. It will allow us to scale and leverage some of the things that are more transactional and don't require the human touch and then free up the time to double down on that human connection and the time that it's like the service you provide the time that people would otherwise have to spend to do down on that human connection and the time that it's like the service you provide the time that people would otherwise have to spend to do the execution that you do. They can take that time and focus it on the individuals and and their part of the business that they do directly. Yeah, um, it's become a bit of a meme now because I end every episode by looking at the clock and being stunned by how quickly time goes, but honestly, it happens every time. Um, I want to make sure that people can find out more about you and and the organization and what you do. Uh, where's a good place for people to go?

Jamie: yeah, on our um, our website, you know, we've got some good tools that will walk you through some of the, the stuff we've been talking about with the dream 25 process and things like that. So the expressory, so theexpressory.com, and you'll be able to uh, follow along or down some of the download, some of those tools perfect.

Stuart: I'll put that link in and a link to your linkedin profile as well. I'll put that in the show notes just to make sure that people have just got to click straight through. And the sessions that you've done recently the webinar sessions, is that?

Jamie: series the q a's, or is that? No um, actually it's. It's ongoing. Um, so you should be getting an email soon on that. So it's a monthly free community call. We have conversations about relationship first related type tactics and strategies. Um, yeah, we talked about some of this stuff.

Stuart: So yeah, and super valuable. I've joined a couple of them. Now I'll put a link directly to that bit of the web page as well, so obviously people can find it themselves, but I'll put a link straight to it because those are were really valuable and super grateful that you put them on. Had some interesting guests. So, yeah, I'd recommend that, as people listen to that, they sign up for for that series as well thank you no problem.

Um, yeah, time goes fast. It'll be really interesting. We should circle back in a couple of months and do another show as well, just maybe dive into. We'll probably get some feedback on this one, particularly so, actually, as people are listening. If there's anything about this specifically that you want us to address in a follow-up, let's do that, so people can just reply to the message and give us a shout and again, really recommend people go to the website and just understand a little bit more about your unique approach, because it is much more valuable than just the generic hey, send someone something for no reason.

Jamie: Yeah thank you, this has been great you and I probably chat for a long time.

Stuart: I know, yeah, yeah well, I think we've got, uh, we're gonna jump on a call next week and we'll, uh, we might share with people at some point in the future what we talk about. Yeah, um, jamie, thanks again for your time. It really does go fast. Everyone, thanks for listening. Check out the show notes. I'll put some connections straight through to Jamie's world and, yep, reach out to either of us with any questions. All right, thank you, we will catch you in the next one.